Re: Understanding boot process.

Re: Understanding boot process.

[Michael Tremer]

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Hello Furkan,

*please* copy the list. I can’t have a conversation in private only with you. This conversation should be shared with other and documented, too.

> On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:42, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote:
> 
> Hey, 
> I don't understand by what you mean kernel that boots on arm?  

We have not ported the configuration and all the patches that we need, yet.

> I will try to reuse your kernel5.9 pkg of x86 and try to build the same for arm boards as I have all the config needed. 

This is not a good idea, because the kernels are slightly different.

> I have been compiling kernels for arm board since 5.0 and maintaining kernel support so I hope I can do the same for ipfire soon. The only thing I might miss is the additional config needed for ipfire which we will come to later once I get the kernel to boot work 5.9.

Exactly, if you just need a kernel that compiles, that is not very difficult to achieve. But we have a custom configuration and we have some patches that make that kernel work better for us. Those need to be tested a lot before we can release them.

> I will try to get it to boot and support you with ARM as I am aware arm is now in your priority list and its not easy to maintain but trust me it will be easily once we have a working image for decent and powerful boards. 

That would be great. I personally do not have any ARM hardware that I use for development any more, but since there is interest in the community to support IPFire on as much hardware as possible, I would support this.

> Thanks for replying.  I will start looking into what I can do with my limited knowledge of ipfire source;) 

Please ask questions. Development is not a quick job. It requires planning, a lot of work and testing.

It is not enough if a device just boots. It has to work. All of it. That includes networking, power management, LEDs, etc. And it needs to perform. There is no point to support hardware for the fun of it. If people cannot use this in production and they cannot rely on things working after the next update it is worthless to spend time on getting it to work in the first place.

Best,
-Michael

> 
> Will stay in touch with you here. 
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:36:43 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ----
> 
> Hello, 
> 
> Again, *please* copy the list. 
> 
> We currently do not have an ARM version of that kernel available. There is only a version for x86. 
> 
> As soon as we have a kernel that boots it will be announced on the development list. So, please watch this space :) 
> 
> -Michael 
> 
> > On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:34, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > 
> > I would love to be part of testing 5.9 as most of the boards are already supported there. 
> > 
> > NanopiR2s 
> > RockpiE 
> > RockpiE3 (RockPiE with extra Lan, total 3 lan) this is development board and not public yet. 
> > 
> > I have good understanding in Dts updates so it will be helpful for ipfire team. I don't mind supporting few devices myself. 
> > 
> > I will dedicate one of my amlogic device for building ipfire images only. 
> > 
> > Please guide me on how I can build images with kernel 5.9 as I have had build images with 4.9 only. 
> > 
> > Thanks 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:31:06 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ---- 
> > 
> > We currently have a version of kernel 5.9 that we are testing and we will target to move to 5.10 as soon as it comes out. 
> > 
> > I hope for a release early next year. 
> > 
> > Best, 
> > -Michael 
> > 
> > P.S. Please do not forget to copy the list. 
> > 
> > > On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:25, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > > 
> > > Hello Michael, 
> > > 
> > > Yes I see that EFI boot is already provied in aarch64 image. 
> > > I am flashing rockpie and using rock64 dtb or I will try it with rockpie itself this time and report back to you by tonight or tomorrow max. 
> > > 
> > > When do you plan to move to kernel 5.4 ? 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:21:43 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ---- 
> > > 
> > > Hello Furkan, 
> > > 
> > > Thanks for signing up and posting :) 
> > > 
> > > I suppose we are talking about ARM64: 
> > > 
> > > We currently only support systems that use EFI. If there is an EFI BIOS, it will launch GRUB and hopefully return all required configuration to the kernel. 
> > > 
> > > > On 22 Nov 2020, at 15:00, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > > > 
> > > > Hello IPFire Team, 
> > > > 
> > > > I would like to understand how do you get the grub to work on the arm images. 
> > > > 
> > > > I have RockPiE which is not supported by your project but I am willing to add support it by myself. 
> > > > 
> > > > Afaik I should be able to get it to boot with other Rk3328 board dtb i have its mainline uboot. 
> > > > 
> > > > It seems to get stuck on grub after selecting the ipfire version it doesnt boot further. 
> > > 
> > > Do you have any output from the bootloader/kernel? 
> > > 
> > > > I suspect that the bootscripts are designed for a specific arm board as every board will have different addr for kernel load. 
> > > 
> > > No, we only support a generic way to boot, because it is simply not feasible for us to provide hundreds of different images for all ARM boards out there. 
> > > 
> > > > Where can I find the source code for the boot script package? 
> > > 
> > > https://git.ipfire.org/?p=ipfire-2.x.git;a=blob;f=lfs/grub;h=811c2f745e267e5ff6c246b66bc5f2196e12b780;hb=HEAD 
> > > 
> > > This is how we install GRUB on x86 and ARM64. 
> > > 
> > > Best, 
> > > -Michael 
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Thank you. 
> > > > 
> > > > _______________________________________________ 
> > > > SIG-ARM mailing list 
> > > > SIG-ARM(a)lists.ipfire.org 
> > > > https://lists.ipfire.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-arm 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 

Re: Understanding boot process.

[Michael Tremer]

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Hello Furkan,

You can find all build instructions in the lfs/ directory.

For the kernel there is lfs/linux and there is lfs/u-boot.

Configuration files for the kernel are in config/kernel.

Best,
-Michael

> On 23 Nov 2020, at 20:14, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote:
> 
> Hey,
> 
> Sorry I didn't release its only replying to you. 
> 
> I will be putting arm build to compile tonight and then see how long it will take for my board  while also looking into the kernel and uboot pkg. 
> 
> Can you just help me with the directories where pkg source are stored for kernel and uboot.
> 
> Thank you. 
> 
> 
> 
> ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 18:02:29 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ----
> 
> Hello Furkan, 
> 
> *please* copy the list. I can’t have a conversation in private only with you. This conversation should be shared with other and documented, too. 
> 
> > On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:42, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > 
> > Hey, 
> > I don't understand by what you mean kernel that boots on arm? 
> 
> We have not ported the configuration and all the patches that we need, yet. 
> 
> > I will try to reuse your kernel5.9 pkg of x86 and try to build the same for arm boards as I have all the config needed. 
> 
> This is not a good idea, because the kernels are slightly different. 
> 
> > I have been compiling kernels for arm board since 5.0 and maintaining kernel support so I hope I can do the same for ipfire soon. The only thing I might miss is the additional config needed for ipfire which we will come to later once I get the kernel to boot work 5.9. 
> 
> Exactly, if you just need a kernel that compiles, that is not very difficult to achieve. But we have a custom configuration and we have some patches that make that kernel work better for us. Those need to be tested a lot before we can release them. 
> 
> > I will try to get it to boot and support you with ARM as I am aware arm is now in your priority list and its not easy to maintain but trust me it will be easily once we have a working image for decent and powerful boards. 
> 
> That would be great. I personally do not have any ARM hardware that I use for development any more, but since there is interest in the community to support IPFire on as much hardware as possible, I would support this. 
> 
> > Thanks for replying. I will start looking into what I can do with my limited knowledge of ipfire source;) 
> 
> Please ask questions. Development is not a quick job. It requires planning, a lot of work and testing. 
> 
> It is not enough if a device just boots. It has to work. All of it. That includes networking, power management, LEDs, etc. And it needs to perform. There is no point to support hardware for the fun of it. If people cannot use this in production and they cannot rely on things working after the next update it is worthless to spend time on getting it to work in the first place. 
> 
> Best, 
> -Michael 
> 
> > 
> > Will stay in touch with you here. 
> > 
> > Thanks. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:36:43 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ---- 
> > 
> > Hello, 
> > 
> > Again, *please* copy the list. 
> > 
> > We currently do not have an ARM version of that kernel available. There is only a version for x86. 
> > 
> > As soon as we have a kernel that boots it will be announced on the development list. So, please watch this space :) 
> > 
> > -Michael 
> > 
> > > On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:34, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > > 
> > > I would love to be part of testing 5.9 as most of the boards are already supported there. 
> > > 
> > > NanopiR2s 
> > > RockpiE 
> > > RockpiE3 (RockPiE with extra Lan, total 3 lan) this is development board and not public yet. 
> > > 
> > > I have good understanding in Dts updates so it will be helpful for ipfire team. I don't mind supporting few devices myself. 
> > > 
> > > I will dedicate one of my amlogic device for building ipfire images only. 
> > > 
> > > Please guide me on how I can build images with kernel 5.9 as I have had build images with 4.9 only. 
> > > 
> > > Thanks 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:31:06 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ---- 
> > > 
> > > We currently have a version of kernel 5.9 that we are testing and we will target to move to 5.10 as soon as it comes out. 
> > > 
> > > I hope for a release early next year. 
> > > 
> > > Best, 
> > > -Michael 
> > > 
> > > P.S. Please do not forget to copy the list. 
> > > 
> > > > On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:25, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > > > 
> > > > Hello Michael, 
> > > > 
> > > > Yes I see that EFI boot is already provied in aarch64 image. 
> > > > I am flashing rockpie and using rock64 dtb or I will try it with rockpie itself this time and report back to you by tonight or tomorrow max. 
> > > > 
> > > > When do you plan to move to kernel 5.4 ? 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:21:43 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ---- 
> > > > 
> > > > Hello Furkan, 
> > > > 
> > > > Thanks for signing up and posting :) 
> > > > 
> > > > I suppose we are talking about ARM64: 
> > > > 
> > > > We currently only support systems that use EFI. If there is an EFI BIOS, it will launch GRUB and hopefully return all required configuration to the kernel. 
> > > > 
> > > > > On 22 Nov 2020, at 15:00, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Hello IPFire Team, 
> > > > > 
> > > > > I would like to understand how do you get the grub to work on the arm images. 
> > > > > 
> > > > > I have RockPiE which is not supported by your project but I am willing to add support it by myself. 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Afaik I should be able to get it to boot with other Rk3328 board dtb i have its mainline uboot. 
> > > > > 
> > > > > It seems to get stuck on grub after selecting the ipfire version it doesnt boot further. 
> > > > 
> > > > Do you have any output from the bootloader/kernel? 
> > > > 
> > > > > I suspect that the bootscripts are designed for a specific arm board as every board will have different addr for kernel load. 
> > > > 
> > > > No, we only support a generic way to boot, because it is simply not feasible for us to provide hundreds of different images for all ARM boards out there. 
> > > > 
> > > > > Where can I find the source code for the boot script package? 
> > > > 
> > > > https://git.ipfire.org/?p=ipfire-2.x.git;a=blob;f=lfs/grub;h=811c2f745e267e5ff6c246b66bc5f2196e12b780;hb=HEAD 
> > > > 
> > > > This is how we install GRUB on x86 and ARM64. 
> > > > 
> > > > Best, 
> > > > -Michael 
> > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Thank you. 
> > > > > 
> > > > > _______________________________________________ 
> > > > > SIG-ARM mailing list 
> > > > > SIG-ARM(a)lists.ipfire.org 
> > > > > https://lists.ipfire.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-arm 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 

Re: Understanding boot process.

[Michael Tremer]

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Hello,

Again, *please* copy the list.

We currently do not have an ARM version of that kernel available. There is only a version for x86.

As soon as we have a kernel that boots it will be announced on the development list. So, please watch this space :)

-Michael

> On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:34, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote:
> 
> I would love to be part of testing 5.9 as most of the boards are already supported there. 
> 
> NanopiR2s
> RockpiE 
> RockpiE3 (RockPiE with extra Lan,  total 3 lan) this is development board and not public yet. 
> 
> I have good understanding in Dts updates so it will be helpful for ipfire team. I don't mind supporting  few devices myself. 
> 
> I will dedicate one of my amlogic device for building ipfire images only. 
> 
> Please guide me on how I can build images with kernel 5.9 as I have had build images with 4.9 only.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:31:06 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ----
> 
> We currently have a version of kernel 5.9 that we are testing and we will target to move to 5.10 as soon as it comes out. 
> 
> I hope for a release early next year. 
> 
> Best, 
> -Michael 
> 
> P.S. Please do not forget to copy the list. 
> 
> > On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:25, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > 
> > Hello Michael, 
> > 
> > Yes I see that EFI boot is already provied in aarch64 image. 
> > I am flashing rockpie and using rock64 dtb or I will try it with rockpie itself this time and report back to you by tonight or tomorrow max. 
> > 
> > When do you plan to move to kernel 5.4 ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:21:43 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ---- 
> > 
> > Hello Furkan, 
> > 
> > Thanks for signing up and posting :) 
> > 
> > I suppose we are talking about ARM64: 
> > 
> > We currently only support systems that use EFI. If there is an EFI BIOS, it will launch GRUB and hopefully return all required configuration to the kernel. 
> > 
> > > On 22 Nov 2020, at 15:00, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > > 
> > > Hello IPFire Team, 
> > > 
> > > I would like to understand how do you get the grub to work on the arm images. 
> > > 
> > > I have RockPiE which is not supported by your project but I am willing to add support it by myself. 
> > > 
> > > Afaik I should be able to get it to boot with other Rk3328 board dtb i have its mainline uboot. 
> > > 
> > > It seems to get stuck on grub after selecting the ipfire version it doesnt boot further. 
> > 
> > Do you have any output from the bootloader/kernel? 
> > 
> > > I suspect that the bootscripts are designed for a specific arm board as every board will have different addr for kernel load. 
> > 
> > No, we only support a generic way to boot, because it is simply not feasible for us to provide hundreds of different images for all ARM boards out there. 
> > 
> > > Where can I find the source code for the boot script package? 
> > 
> > https://git.ipfire.org/?p=ipfire-2.x.git;a=blob;f=lfs/grub;h=811c2f745e267e5ff6c246b66bc5f2196e12b780;hb=HEAD 
> > 
> > This is how we install GRUB on x86 and ARM64. 
> > 
> > Best, 
> > -Michael 
> > 
> > > 
> > > Thank you. 
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________ 
> > > SIG-ARM mailing list 
> > > SIG-ARM(a)lists.ipfire.org 
> > > https://lists.ipfire.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-arm 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 

Re: Understanding boot process.

[Michael Tremer]

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We currently have a version of kernel 5.9 that we are testing and we will target to move to 5.10 as soon as it comes out.

I hope for a release early next year.

Best,
-Michael

P.S. Please do not forget to copy the list.

> On 23 Nov 2020, at 11:25, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello Michael,
> 
> Yes I see that EFI boot  is already provied in aarch64 image. 
> I am flashing rockpie and using rock64 dtb or I will try it with rockpie itself this time and report back to you by tonight or tomorrow max. 
> 
> When do you plan to move to kernel 5.4 ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---- On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 14:21:43 +0300 michael.tremer(a)ipfire.org wrote ----
> 
> Hello Furkan, 
> 
> Thanks for signing up and posting :) 
> 
> I suppose we are talking about ARM64: 
> 
> We currently only support systems that use EFI. If there is an EFI BIOS, it will launch GRUB and hopefully return all required configuration to the kernel. 
> 
> > On 22 Nov 2020, at 15:00, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote: 
> > 
> > Hello IPFire Team, 
> > 
> > I would like to understand how do you get the grub to work on the arm images. 
> > 
> > I have RockPiE which is not supported by your project but I am willing to add support it by myself. 
> > 
> > Afaik I should be able to get it to boot with other Rk3328 board dtb i have its mainline uboot. 
> > 
> > It seems to get stuck on grub after selecting the ipfire version it doesnt boot further. 
> 
> Do you have any output from the bootloader/kernel? 
> 
> > I suspect that the bootscripts are designed for a specific arm board as every board will have different addr for kernel load. 
> 
> No, we only support a generic way to boot, because it is simply not feasible for us to provide hundreds of different images for all ARM boards out there. 
> 
> > Where can I find the source code for the boot script package? 
> 
> https://git.ipfire.org/?p=ipfire-2.x.git;a=blob;f=lfs/grub;h=811c2f745e267e5ff6c246b66bc5f2196e12b780;hb=HEAD 
> 
> This is how we install GRUB on x86 and ARM64. 
> 
> Best, 
> -Michael 
> 
> > 
> > Thank you. 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > SIG-ARM mailing list 
> > SIG-ARM(a)lists.ipfire.org 
> > https://lists.ipfire.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-arm 
> 
> 

Re: Understanding boot process.

[Michael Tremer]

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Hello Furkan,

Thanks for signing up and posting :)

I suppose we are talking about ARM64:

We currently only support systems that use EFI. If there is an EFI BIOS, it will launch GRUB and hopefully return all required configuration to the kernel.

> On 22 Nov 2020, at 15:00, Furkan Salman <tech(a)fkardame.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello IPFire Team, 
> 
> I would like to understand how do you get the grub to work on the arm images. 
> 
> I have RockPiE which is not supported by your project but I am willing to add support it by myself.  
> 
> Afaik I should be able to get it to boot with other Rk3328 board dtb i have its mainline uboot. 
> 
> It seems to get stuck on grub after selecting the ipfire version it doesnt boot further. 

Do you have any output from the bootloader/kernel?

> I suspect that the bootscripts are designed for a specific arm board as every board will have different addr for kernel load. 

No, we only support a generic way to boot, because it is simply not feasible for us to provide hundreds of different images for all ARM boards out there.

> Where can I find the source code for the boot script package?  

https://git.ipfire.org/?p=ipfire-2.x.git;a=blob;f=lfs/grub;h=811c2f745e267e5ff6c246b66bc5f2196e12b780;hb=HEAD

This is how we install GRUB on x86 and ARM64.

Best,
-Michael

> 
> Thank you. 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> SIG-ARM mailing list
> SIG-ARM(a)lists.ipfire.org
> https://lists.ipfire.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-arm