Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
1. Can anyone confirm?
2. With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
1. Confirmed. Seems to happen randomly about twice a month or so.
2. My first guess of the cause is that as logwatch runs at the same time as logrotate it causes a race condition:
# fcrontab -l|grep log 2019-02-17 12:32:01 INFO listing root's fcrontab 01 * * * * /usr/sbin/logrotate /etc/logrotate.conf 01 0 * * * /usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
Try changing the minute value in logwatch to 02 or maybe 03 to be on the safe side.
Incidentally, why is logrotate being run every hour? Wouldn't daily be enough?
Tapani
On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 10:22:26AM +0100, Matthias Fischer (matthias.fischer@ipfire.org) wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 11:38, Tapani Tarvainen wrote:
Hi,
- Confirmed. Seems to happen randomly about twice a month or so.
Ok, I'm not alone. ;-)
- My first guess of the cause is that as logwatch runs at the same time as logrotate it causes a race condition:
# fcrontab -l|grep log 2019-02-17 12:32:01 INFO listing root's fcrontab 01 * * * * /usr/sbin/logrotate /etc/logrotate.conf 01 0 * * * /usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
Try changing the minute value in logwatch to 02 or maybe 03 to be on the safe side.
Done. Changed to "03". We'll see.
Incidentally, why is logrotate being run every hour? Wouldn't daily be enough?
No idea. Better granularity?
Best, Matthias
Tapani
On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 10:22:26AM +0100, Matthias Fischer (matthias.fischer@ipfire.org) wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
I do not think that you have two reports in the larger file.
In the cronjob line the file is being overwritten (>) and not appended (>>).
Is it possible that this conflicts with the logrotate job that is launched at the same time and logwatch tries to read files that are being rotated away?
-Michael
On 17 Feb 2019, at 15:01, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
On 18.02.2019 13:38, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hi,
I do not think that you have two reports in the larger file.
In the cronjob line the file is being overwritten (>) and not appended (>>).
I see.
Is it possible that this conflicts with the logrotate job that is launched at the same time and logwatch tries to read files that are being rotated away?
This was my first suspicion. After changing the start time of the 'logwatch'-job the error did not occur again until now. I'll wait and watch.
Best, Matthias
-Michael
On 17 Feb 2019, at 15:01, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Cool.
I think logwatch might require to be started on the top of the hour.
But for logrotate it doesn’t matter much and I think we probably should run it a bit more often anyways. Maybe every 15 minutes or so...
-Michael
On 18 Feb 2019, at 13:14, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 18.02.2019 13:38, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hi,
I do not think that you have two reports in the larger file.
In the cronjob line the file is being overwritten (>) and not appended (>>).
I see.
Is it possible that this conflicts with the logrotate job that is launched at the same time and logwatch tries to read files that are being rotated away?
This was my first suspicion. After changing the start time of the 'logwatch'-job the error did not occur again until now. I'll wait and watch.
Best, Matthias
-Michael
On 17 Feb 2019, at 15:01, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
For testing, I changed the conjob for logwatch from to "03 0 * * * " but tonight 'logwatch' did it again:
"No (or only partial) logs exist for the day queried: /var/log/logwatch/2019-03-31 could not be opened."
So it took some time, but the bug still exists.
Any suggestions? I think, I should open a bug report...
Best, Matthias
On 18.02.2019 14:14, Matthias Fischer wrote:
Hi,
On 18.02.2019 13:38, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hi,
I do not think that you have two reports in the larger file.
In the cronjob line the file is being overwritten (>) and not appended (>>).
I see.
Is it possible that this conflicts with the logrotate job that is launched at the same time and logwatch tries to read files that are being rotated away?
This was my first suspicion. After changing the start time of the 'logwatch'-job the error did not occur again until now. I'll wait and watch.
Best, Matthias
-Michael
On 17 Feb 2019, at 15:01, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
Yes, please open a bug report and we will take it from there.
Best, -Michael
On 1 Apr 2019, at 17:28, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
For testing, I changed the conjob for logwatch from to "03 0 * * * " but tonight 'logwatch' did it again:
"No (or only partial) logs exist for the day queried: /var/log/logwatch/2019-03-31 could not be opened."
So it took some time, but the bug still exists.
Any suggestions? I think, I should open a bug report...
Best, Matthias
On 18.02.2019 14:14, Matthias Fischer wrote:
Hi,
On 18.02.2019 13:38, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hi,
I do not think that you have two reports in the larger file.
In the cronjob line the file is being overwritten (>) and not appended (>>).
I see.
Is it possible that this conflicts with the logrotate job that is launched at the same time and logwatch tries to read files that are being rotated away?
This was my first suspicion. After changing the start time of the 'logwatch'-job the error did not occur again until now. I'll wait and watch.
Best, Matthias
-Michael
On 17 Feb 2019, at 15:01, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
I discovered something weird:
From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log.
E.g.: The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes.
The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': 0 Bytes.
After running...
/usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';'
...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok.
Can anyone confirm?
With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so
that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on this...
Best, Matthias
Hi,
Done.
=> https://bugzilla.ipfire.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12036
Best, Matthias
On 01.04.2019 18:34, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hi,
Yes, please open a bug report and we will take it from there.
Best, -Michael
On 1 Apr 2019, at 17:28, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
For testing, I changed the conjob for logwatch from to "03 0 * * * " but tonight 'logwatch' did it again:
"No (or only partial) logs exist for the day queried: /var/log/logwatch/2019-03-31 could not be opened."
So it took some time, but the bug still exists.
Any suggestions? I think, I should open a bug report...
Best, Matthias
On 18.02.2019 14:14, Matthias Fischer wrote:
Hi,
On 18.02.2019 13:38, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hi,
I do not think that you have two reports in the larger file.
In the cronjob line the file is being overwritten (>) and not appended (>>).
I see.
Is it possible that this conflicts with the logrotate job that is launched at the same time and logwatch tries to read files that are being rotated away?
This was my first suspicion. After changing the start time of the 'logwatch'-job the error did not occur again until now. I'll wait and watch.
Best, Matthias
-Michael
On 17 Feb 2019, at 15:01, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
On 17.02.2019 15:42, Tom Rymes wrote:
Is this a ticking issue where one log has two days’ data and the other is empty?
[Correction: Of course I meant '.../2019-01-26' ;-) ]
Looking an it - could be the case. The log created on 2019-01-28 is significantly bigger:
***SNIP*** ... -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 43698 Jan 24 00:01 2019-01-23 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 56469 Jan 25 00:01 2019-01-24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 57936 Jan 26 00:01 2019-01-25 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 Jan 27 00:01 2019-01-26 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 114650 Jan 28 00:01 2019-01-27 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 40121 Jan 29 00:01 2019-01-28 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 38220 Jan 30 00:01 2019-01-29 ... ***SNAP***
But what can I do about this? For now, I changed running time to "03 0 * * *".
Best, Matthias
> On Feb 17, 2019, at 4:22 AM, Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org wrote: > > Hi, > > I discovered something weird: > > From time to time 'logwatch' does not create a daily log. > > E.g.: > The file '/var/log/logwatch/2019-14-26' exists, but size = 0 Bytes. > > The same happened yesterday with '/var/log/logwatch/2019-02-16': > 0 Bytes. > > After running... > > /usr/local/bin/logwatch > /var/log/logwatch/`date -I -d yesterday`; \ > LOGWATCH_KEEP=$(sed -ne 's/^LOGWATCH_KEEP=([0-9]+)$/\1/p' > /var/ipfire/logging/settings); \ > find /var/log/logwatch/ -ctime +${LOGWATCH_KEEP=56} -exec rm -f '{}' ';' > > ...manually from console, file was created, everything looks ok. > > 1. Can anyone confirm? > > 2. With which parameter could I change the starting time "01 0 * * *" so > that this doesn't happen again? I'm searching, but can't find a grip on > this... > > Best, > Matthias
-
Matthias Fischer -
Michael Tremer -
Tapani Tarvainen -
Tom Rymes