Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail: - PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection - IPsec (N2N connections only) - Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy) - OpenVPN (RW connections only) - IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled) - Guardian - Quality of Service - DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation) - Dynamic DNS - Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
* You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of * Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Hello,
Am 02.11.2021 um 11:34 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
I've implemented the changes also ( took them from the patches ). I found this difference, too. The 'old' state is, that the messages of the last pakfire call are displayed. The patch tries to show the actual update progress. But nothing of it is displayed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
- Bernhard
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 10:58, Bernhard Bitsch bbitsch@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello,
Am 02.11.2021 um 11:34 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
I've implemented the changes also ( took them from the patches ). I found this difference, too. The 'old' state is, that the messages of the last pakfire call are displayed. The patch tries to show the actual update progress. But nothing of it is displayed.
I still don’t quite understand.
When you click the update button and confirm that you want to install something, you should see a screen with a message that “Pakfire is busy” and an animated icon.
At the bottom of the page, you might see some log lines from /var/log/messages. If you have too much stuff being logged, you might not see much here.
What do you get?
The behaviour should be the same since the beginning of IPFire 2.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
- Bernhard
Hello,
Am 04.11.2021 um 13:37 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 10:58, Bernhard Bitsch bbitsch@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello,
Am 02.11.2021 um 11:34 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
I've implemented the changes also ( took them from the patches ). I found this difference, too. The 'old' state is, that the messages of the last pakfire call are displayed. The patch tries to show the actual update progress. But nothing of it is displayed.
I still don’t quite understand.
When you click the update button and confirm that you want to install something, you should see a screen with a message that “Pakfire is busy” and an animated icon.
At the bottom of the page, you might see some log lines from /var/log/messages. If you have too much stuff being logged, you might not see much here.
What do you get?
The behaviour should be the same since the beginning of IPFire 2.
I get the animated icon and the "Pakfire is busy" message, but no log excerpts. This behaviour is new with this patch. Are there other changes in the general page routines and description ( CSS ), which I've overseen? I've changed pakfire.cgi only.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
- Bernhard
Hi All,
My input is very simple. The update occurred without any hiccups and every thing I have been able to evaluate looks to be working fine. No problems found.
Regards,
Adolf.
On 04/11/2021 22:07, Bernhard Bitsch wrote:
Hello,
Am 04.11.2021 um 13:37 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 10:58, Bernhard Bitsch bbitsch@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello,
Am 02.11.2021 um 11:34 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
I've implemented the changes also ( took them from the patches ). I found this difference, too. The 'old' state is, that the messages of the last pakfire call are displayed. The patch tries to show the actual update progress. But nothing of it is displayed.
I still don’t quite understand.
When you click the update button and confirm that you want to install something, you should see a screen with a message that “Pakfire is busy” and an animated icon.
At the bottom of the page, you might see some log lines from /var/log/messages. If you have too much stuff being logged, you might not see much here.
What do you get?
The behaviour should be the same since the beginning of IPFire 2.
I get the animated icon and the "Pakfire is busy" message, but no log excerpts. This behaviour is new with this patch. Are there other changes in the general page routines and description ( CSS ), which I've overseen? I've changed pakfire.cgi only.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
- Bernhard
Hello,
Thank you for all your feedback. I think we can look at a release very soon.
-Michael
On 10 Nov 2021, at 12:48, Adolf Belka adolf.belka@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi All,
My input is very simple. The update occurred without any hiccups and every thing I have been able to evaluate looks to be working fine. No problems found.
Regards,
Adolf.
On 04/11/2021 22:07, Bernhard Bitsch wrote:
Hello,
Am 04.11.2021 um 13:37 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 10:58, Bernhard Bitsch bbitsch@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello,
Am 02.11.2021 um 11:34 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
I've implemented the changes also ( took them from the patches ). I found this difference, too. The 'old' state is, that the messages of the last pakfire call are displayed. The patch tries to show the actual update progress. But nothing of it is displayed.
I still don’t quite understand.
When you click the update button and confirm that you want to install something, you should see a screen with a message that “Pakfire is busy” and an animated icon.
At the bottom of the page, you might see some log lines from /var/log/messages. If you have too much stuff being logged, you might not see much here.
What do you get?
The behaviour should be the same since the beginning of IPFire 2.
I get the animated icon and the "Pakfire is busy" message, but no log excerpts. This behaviour is new with this patch. Are there other changes in the general page routines and description ( CSS ), which I've overseen? I've changed pakfire.cgi only.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
- Bernhard
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people don’t download packages over a VPN. So I can live with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI, they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only. While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone, hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing.
Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
Please note: Although we may sometimes respond to email, text and phone calls instantly at all hours of the day and night, our regular business hours are 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM ET, Monday thru Friday.
-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Hi,
as far as I saw in the code, the new CGI tries the refreshing of the tail -f also. But it is never displayed. I tried to search by test prints, but had no success, yet. Because I didn't test the real CU 161, I'm not sure I've implemented all changes ( especially these new systemxxx functions). So I decided to stop this research. I'll give a new try next days.
Regards, Bernhard
Am 12.11.2021 um 19:54 schrieb Kienker, Fred:
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
Please note: Although we may sometimes respond to email, text and phone calls instantly at all hours of the day and night, our regular business hours are 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM ET, Monday thru Friday.
-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Am 12.11.2021 um 23:33 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Hi,
as far as I saw in the code, the new CGI tries the refreshing of the tail -f also. But it is never displayed. I tried to search by test prints, but had no success, yet.
Reinstalled my test prints. The processing I saw till now: - update is called waiting for lock ( 7 x sleep(1) ) - no output( lockfile does not exist ) Each - block describes a call of the .cgi
Next I'll add some timing information.
Because I didn't test the real CU 161, I'm not sure I've implemented all changes ( especially these new systemxxx functions). So I decided to stop this research. I'll give a new try next days.
Regards, Bernhard
Am 12.11.2021 um 19:54 schrieb Kienker, Fred:
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
Please note: Although we may sometimes respond to email, text and phone calls instantly at all hours of the day and night, our regular business hours are 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM ET, Monday thru Friday.
-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Am 12.11.2021 um 23:33 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Hi,
as far as I saw in the code, the new CGI tries the refreshing of the tail -f also. But it is never displayed. I tried to search by test prints, but had no success, yet.
Reinstalled my test prints. The processing I saw till now: - update is called waiting for lock ( 7 x sleep(1) ) - no output( lockfile does not exist ) Each - block describes a call of the .cgi
Next I'll add some timing information.
Update: time between calls ~35-40s
Because I didn't test the real CU 161, I'm not sure I've implemented all changes ( especially these new systemxxx functions). So I decided to stop this research. I'll give a new try next days.
Regards, Bernhard
Am 12.11.2021 um 19:54 schrieb Kienker, Fred:
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
Please note: Although we may sometimes respond to email, text and phone calls instantly at all hours of the day and night, our regular business hours are 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM ET, Monday thru Friday.
-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Hi,
Am 14.11.2021 um 11:52 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Am 12.11.2021 um 23:33 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Hi,
as far as I saw in the code, the new CGI tries the refreshing of the tail -f also. But it is never displayed. I tried to search by test prints, but had no success, yet.
Reinstalled my test prints. The processing I saw till now:
- update is called
waiting for lock ( 7 x sleep(1) )
- no output( lockfile does not exist )
Each - block describes a call of the .cgi
I think, there's a problem with the refreshing of the page. I'm no HTML guru, but I suppose the refreshing only works on open pages. If do not exit the cgi script, but just go to the display of the logs, I managed to get a second box with the log snippet. Could somebody with more experience in web design look at this?
Next I'll add some timing information.
Update: time between calls ~35-40s
- Bernhard
Because I didn't test the real CU 161, I'm not sure I've implemented all changes ( especially these new systemxxx functions). So I decided to stop this research. I'll give a new try next days.
Regards, Bernhard
Am 12.11.2021 um 19:54 schrieb Kienker, Fred:
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
Please note: Although we may sometimes respond to email, text and phone calls instantly at all hours of the day and night, our regular business hours are 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM ET, Monday thru Friday.
-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Hello,
On 15 Nov 2021, at 14:09, Bernhard Bitsch bbitsch@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
Am 14.11.2021 um 11:52 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Am 12.11.2021 um 23:33 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Hi,
as far as I saw in the code, the new CGI tries the refreshing of the tail -f also. But it is never displayed. I tried to search by test prints, but had no success, yet.
Reinstalled my test prints. The processing I saw till now:
- update is called waiting for lock ( 7 x sleep(1) )
- no output( lockfile does not exist )
Each - block describes a call of the .cgi
I think, there's a problem with the refreshing of the page. I'm no HTML guru, but I suppose the refreshing only works on open pages. If do not exit the cgi script, but just go to the display of the logs, I managed to get a second box with the log snippet. Could somebody with more experience in web design look at this?
Is this regarding the solution before the latest patch or after?
-Michael
Next I'll add some timing information. Update: time between calls ~35-40s
- Bernhard
Because I didn't test the real CU 161, I'm not sure I've implemented all changes ( especially these new systemxxx functions). So I decided to stop this research. I'll give a new try next days.
Regards, Bernhard
Am 12.11.2021 um 19:54 schrieb Kienker, Fred:
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
Please note: Although we may sometimes respond to email, text and phone calls instantly at all hours of the day and night, our regular business hours are 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM ET, Monday thru Friday.
-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
Hello *,
Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
(For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time to do so.)
Tested IPFire functionalities in detail:
- PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection
- IPsec (N2N connections only)
- Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy)
- OpenVPN (RW connections only)
- IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled)
- Guardian
- Quality of Service
- DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation)
- Dynamic DNS
- Tor (relay mode)
I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
-Michael
Hi,
Am 18.11.2021 um 10:58 schrieb Michael Tremer:
Hello,
On 15 Nov 2021, at 14:09, Bernhard Bitsch bbitsch@ipfire.org wrote:
Hi,
Am 14.11.2021 um 11:52 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Am 12.11.2021 um 23:33 schrieb Bernhard Bitsch:
Hi,
as far as I saw in the code, the new CGI tries the refreshing of the tail -f also. But it is never displayed. I tried to search by test prints, but had no success, yet.
Reinstalled my test prints. The processing I saw till now:
- update is called waiting for lock ( 7 x sleep(1) )
- no output( lockfile does not exist )
Each - block describes a call of the .cgi
I think, there's a problem with the refreshing of the page. I'm no HTML guru, but I suppose the refreshing only works on open pages. If do not exit the cgi script, but just go to the display of the logs, I managed to get a second box with the log snippet. Could somebody with more experience in web design look at this?
Is this regarding the solution before the latest patch or after?
-Michael
I think this was ( and is ) the behaviour of the update/upgrade part. We didn't look accurately at this until now. I noticed it just on testing the patch for the new processing.
- Bernhard
Next I'll add some timing information. Update: time between calls ~35-40s
- Bernhard
Because I didn't test the real CU 161, I'm not sure I've implemented all changes ( especially these new systemxxx functions). So I decided to stop this research. I'll give a new try next days.
Regards, Bernhard
Am 12.11.2021 um 19:54 schrieb Kienker, Fred:
Peter - the behavior you describe also happens on all our testing systems. It took us several tries to realize the systems hand not just locked up.
Michael - this is a regression from previous behavior.
There is never any indication to the user the update processing has been completed. The tailf of the update log provided an indication of when the processing is completed.
Best regards, Fred
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-----Original Message----- From: Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 12:32 PM To: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org Cc: IPFire: Development development@lists.ipfire.org Subject: Re: Core Update 161 (testing) report
Hello Michael,
thanks for your mail. Please excuse my tardy reply - I currently have a lot of other things on my plate, and 24 hours per day are not sufficient to get them done.
[Insert personal load average graph here]
Hello,
> On 2 Nov 2021, at 08:01, Peter Müller peter.mueller@ipfire.org
wrote:
> > Hello *, > > Core Update 161 (testing; no release announcement or changelog has > been published, yet) is running here for about 12 hours by now
without any major issues known so far.
Yay \o/
> During the upgrade, I noticed the Pakfire CGI still does not display > log messages as it used to do, but at least there is now a spinning > loading icon displaying the message that an operation is currently in
progress. From a UX perspective, this is okay I guess.
What is different about it?
The older CGI used to print a "tail -f"-like output of Pakfire's log, reloading the page every few seconds so the user could see the actual process of the ongoing operation.
Nowadays, it only gives a spinning GIF image and a text note - better than nothing, but the user has no idea what is going on behind the scenes and how long it will take to be completed.
> The reconnection necessary for upgrading pppd went smooth, albeit > Pakfire could not download add-on upgrades afterwards since the VPN > did not came back in time, so I had to do this manually.
Normally people dont download packages over a VPN. So I can live
with this.
> To my surprise, some IPsec N2N connections did not reconnect > automatically, even after rebooting the testing machine. After > manually clicking on one of the "restart" buttons on the IPsec CGI,
they came back instantly, and have been stable ever since.
Anything in the logs? It should come back automatically.
Unfortunately, I did not yet have time to look at this.
> This affected N2N connections not being in the "on-demand" mode only.
> While it is not really a show-stopper if someone is sitting in front > of his/her/its IPFire machine, remote upgrades might be tricky.
Indeed. Could you please investigate further whether this is or is not
a regression introduced in this update?
Will do.
> Apart from that, this update looks quite good to me. The IPS changes > are really noticeable, and bring a throughput I think I never > experienced with IPFire and the IPS turned on. :-) This is certainly > worth mentioning, as it finally makes the IPS suitable for everyone,
hence massively increasing security without worrying too much of performance impacts.
> > (For the sake of completeness: Unfortunately I did not yet have time > do conduct a penetration test against this. Personally, I can imagine
> the IPS changes permitting some attacks after Suricata decided it > cannot analyse a connection further. Switching protocols might be an
issue, starting with TLS, while using something completely different afterwards.
I expected you to bring this up a lot earlier and it is indeed a
concern. Although I think it is a theoretical one:
- You cannot really change back from a TLS connection on any
application that I am aware of
- Suricata only does this if it is very very certain that the
connection can be bypassed and just hope the guys over there know what they are doing. Yes. Again, things are quite packet on my end - sorry.
Indeed, it is a rather theoretical setup: If an attacker already got a TLS connection established so far that Suricata cannot look into it anymore, why not use that connection to conduct the malicious activities? There is no need to do protocol obfuscation anymore.
Thanks, and best regards, Peter Müller
> While I do not really consider this to be a critical attack surface, > I wanted to look deeper into this as soon as I have some spare time > to do so.) > > Tested IPFire functionalities in detail: > - PPPoE dial-up via a DSL connection > - IPsec (N2N connections only) > - Squid (authentication enabled, using an upstream proxy) > - OpenVPN (RW connections only) > - IPS/Suricata (with Emerging Threats community ruleset enabled) > - Guardian > - Quality of Service > - DNS (using DNS over TLS and strict QNAME minimisation) > - Dynamic DNS > - Tor (relay mode) > > I am looking forward to the release of Core Update 161. > > Thanks, and best regards, > Peter Müller
-Michael
-
Adolf Belka -
Bernhard Bitsch -
Kienker, Fred -
Michael Tremer -
Peter Müller