Well sorry for the late reply (used wrong reply address),
I agree that the load can also be found in the graphs and that the logged on user is also not necessary to have in the bar. Besides Fischers request from the Forum, I just took a look on the legacy theme were the complete Uptime output was also in the footer, so even it didn't make any different for my self I included it again.
But time and timezone (you do not always administrate a machine that is in the local timezone, or maybe use the UTC time for your network) should really be displayed in GUI. The Uptime should also be displayed, maybe only on the home site. I don't want to check the logs when was last reboot, or if I see uptime is short I can check the logs for the reason.
Regarding the load, I have an solution in mind to reduce the load for the server. But first it should be clear if the display of the system time in the GUI is wanted or not.
-Kim
-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [PATCH] actual system time and timezone info-bar to ipfire theme From: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org To: Matthias Fischer matthias.fischer@ipfire.org, development@lists.ipfire.org Date: 2015.08.13 - 23:25:32
On Thu, 2015-08-13 at 19:33 +0200, Matthias Fischer wrote:
Hi,
my few cents for this:
I'm used to see some (important) information by the *first* look, especially things regarding the actual 'time', 'uptime', 'load' and 'traffic'. For example: in the past I had to search for the load graph to see if "something is going on", now I see it at a glance. Good. For me, this is an important information, other opinions may vary...
I get that, but the firewall is not really a good thing to check for the time. You will also not really notice if the clock is a minute or two off.
Why do you check the uptime on your machines? And what does the load tell you? The only thing that is interesting to know about the load is how it develops over time and we have that in a graph.
In my view, 'Date' and 'User:' are not so important, similar to the 'Automatic update'-feature. For me it would be ok, if this would be static and only updated generating the current page.
This is why I originally added these wanted information by simply adding some ~kind of 'uptime'-command to my footer: http://forum.ipfire.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=12177#p88508
Furthermore, I noticed that keeping a page open costs some system load, generated by Javascript(?).
This will fork a new perl process every time, load the code of the web user interface, execute the CGI and then send back the result. I did not look at the code what is done and how often it is done.
Not sure what you are asking, but this creates load on both the client and firewall.
-Michael
Jm2C Regards Matthias
On 13.08.2015 18:33, Michael Tremer wrote:
Hello,
On Thu, 2015-08-13 at 15:00 +0200, Larsen wrote:
Hi Kim,
I have been using this for not so long either, but I can tell you that patches should be sent inline (no attachment) and you have to disable
Indeed, we can comment on an inline patch much easier. Patchwork however parsed the attachment correctly, so it is okay for this time.
line-wrap in your mail client. Some examples: http://patchwork.ipfire.org/project/ipfire/list/
On the thing itself: I saw the conversation on the IPFire forum and must say that I do not really get why all this information is needed on the web user interface. So I would like to discuss this first before looking closely at the patch.
Time: I get that this is a good information to know just to check if the clock of the system is running correctly. If the timezone needs to be included if it is local time is debatable.
Load: I do not really understand why this is an important information that should be on every single page of the web user interface. Most users do not even really understand the meaning of these values and often worry about numbers above a certain value they are used to.
I think this could be as well below the load graph.
Logged in users and uptime: There is no point in this. I wonder why you find this is important.
So this information is automatically updated by Javascript every other second. This will always return a wrong time because there is obviously lots of latency on the network. What is wrong with just embedding the time when the page was generated?
I just would like to hear your objective or opinion on this.
Best, -Michael
hth, Lars
On Thu, 13 Aug 2015 14:50:52 +0200, Xaver4all xaver4all@gmx.de wrote:
Hi all,
this is my first time using this mailing-list thing, so hopefully I do everything according to your CoC.
[PATCH] add actual system time and timezone info-bar to ipfire theme. position can be configured in GUI user-settings, default is off.
future reference, German discussion in forum: http://forum.ipfire.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=12177
attached is a patch against the actual next branch
br, Kim
Hi,
On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 04:03:26 +0200, Xaver4all xaver4all@gmx.de wrote:
But time and timezone (you do not always administrate a machine that is in the local timezone, or maybe use the UTC time for your network) should really be displayed in GUI. The Uptime should also be displayed, maybe only on the home site. I don't want to check the logs when was last reboot, or if I see uptime is short I can check the logs for the reason.
I don't understand why you need that information. When I want to add a firewall rule or a VPN user, I couldn't care less for any of that information. So, perhaps you want to explain how exactly this is useful for your working scenario.
Lars
I'm sorry that this information is not useful for your workflow, but I don't want to waste your and my time, to explain you my working scenario.
But I will give two examples: I guess form your mail that you don't use the GUI to check the logs, because if you do so how do you tell how old is a given log entry. Or if you add a firewall rule which should only apply on workdays form 8-16 o'clock. So when you do something like this you have to connect via SSH and check the time and for the rest you use the GUI? IHO this is not very handy. Or do you just trust a system that is running 24/7 and you set the clock one's and believe that the time doesn't get messed up (even with an daily NTP update). There are Country's with daylight saving period so timezone offset could also get changed (at least on your workstation).
Kim
Hi,
On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 04:03:26 +0200, Xaver4all xaver4all@gmx.de wrote:
But time and timezone (you do not always administrate a machine that is in the local timezone, or maybe use the UTC time for your network) should really be displayed in GUI. The Uptime should also be displayed, maybe only on the home site. I don't want to check the logs when was last reboot, or if I see uptime is short I can check the logs for the reason.
I don't understand why you need that information. When I want to add a firewall rule or a VPN user, I couldn't care less for any of that information. So, perhaps you want to explain how exactly this is useful for your working scenario.
Lars
Hi,
On Wed, 2015-09-02 at 21:02 +0900, Xaver4all wrote:
I'm sorry that this information is not useful for your workflow, but I don't want to waste your and my time, to explain you my working scenario.
you must accept a certain discourse about these things. If we would accept every patch without considering it carefully, we might have really messed up distribution after a while. Everything that is added must make sense, must not harm the system and must be maintained by someone.
But I will give two examples: I guess form your mail that you don't use the GUI to check the logs, because if you do so how do you tell how old is a given log entry. Or if you add a firewall rule which should only apply on workdays form 8-16 o'clock. So when you do something like this you have to connect via SSH and check the time and for the rest you use the GUI? IHO this is not very handy. Or do you just trust a system that is running 24/7 and you set the clock one's and believe that the time doesn't get messed up (even with an daily NTP update). There are Country's with daylight saving period so timezone offset could also get changed (at least on your workstation).
So this a point for showing the system clock I can agree to. I would like to suggest to add it to the already existing bar at the top, because I think that it will fit wonderfully to the right of the speed -o-meter which can be made a bit more narrow to make the needed space.
The time should definitely include the timezone. I am not sure if secon ds must be included. A piece of JS that automatically updates the time is nice, but must be optional for browsers that do not support JS.
Best, -Michael
Kim
Hi,
On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 04:03:26 +0200, Xaver4all xaver4all@gmx.de wrote:
But time and timezone (you do not always administrate a machine that is in the local timezone, or maybe use the UTC time for your network) should really be displayed in GUI. The Uptime should also be displayed, maybe only on the home site. I don't want to check the logs when was last reboot, or if I see uptime is short I can check the logs for the reason.
I don't understand why you need that information. When I want to add a firewall rule or a VPN user, I couldn't care less for any of that information. So, perhaps you want to explain how exactly this is useful for your working scenario.
Lars
Hi,
Date: 2015.09.09 - 23:27:19 - From: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org
Hi,
On Wed, 2015-09-02 at 21:02 +0900, Xaver4all wrote:
I'm sorry that this information is not useful for your workflow, but I don't want to waste your and my time, to explain you my working scenario.
you must accept a certain discourse about these things. If we would accept every patch without considering it carefully, we might have really messed up distribution after a while. Everything that is added must make sense, must not harm the system and must be maintained by someone.
I accept the discourse and I also like the you (the developer) think twice before you accept patches. I didn't expect that this patch would go in the way it is now. I just wanted to express that this patch is not bound to my personal working scenario. Sorry that I may phrased it a bit harsh.
But I will give two examples: I guess form your mail that you don't use the GUI to check the logs, because if you do so how do you tell how old is a given log entry. Or if you add a firewall rule which should only apply on workdays form 8-16 o'clock. So when you do something like this you have to connect via SSH and check the time and for the rest you use the GUI? IHO this is not very handy. Or do you just trust a system that is running 24/7 and you set the clock one's and believe that the time doesn't get messed up (even with an daily NTP update). There are Country's with daylight saving period so timezone offset could also get changed (at least on your workstation).
So this a point for showing the system clock I can agree to. I would like to suggest to add it to the already existing bar at the top, because I think that it will fit wonderfully to the right of the speed -o-meter which can be made a bit more narrow to make the needed space.
The time should definitely include the timezone. I am not sure if secon ds must be included. A piece of JS that automatically updates the time is nice, but must be optional for browsers that do not support JS.
Like i have written in the forum, by end of month I will provide a different version. I agree to perhaps drop the seconds, as it's a good way to save space.
Best, -Michael
Kim
Hi,
On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 04:03:26 +0200, Xaver4all xaver4all@gmx.de wrote:
But time and timezone (you do not always administrate a machine that is in the local timezone, or maybe use the UTC time for your network) should really be displayed in GUI. The Uptime should also be displayed, maybe only on the home site. I don't want to check the logs when was last reboot, or if I see uptime is short I can check the logs for the reason.
I don't understand why you need that information. When I want to add a firewall rule or a VPN user, I couldn't care less for any of that information. So, perhaps you want to explain how exactly this is useful for your working scenario.
Lars
On Thu, 2015-09-10 at 00:13 +0900, Xaver4all wrote:
Hi,
Date: 2015.09.09 - 23:27:19 - From: Michael Tremer michael.tremer@ipfire.org
Hi,
On Wed, 2015-09-02 at 21:02 +0900, Xaver4all wrote:
I'm sorry that this information is not useful for your workflow, but I don't want to waste your and my time, to explain you my working scenario.
you must accept a certain discourse about these things. If we would accept every patch without considering it carefully, we might have really messed up distribution after a while. Everything that is added must make sense, must not harm the system and must be maintained by someone.
I accept the discourse and I also like the you (the developer) think twice before you accept patches. I didn't expect that this patch would go in the way it is now.
Most patches don't. That is why we have this list. I also expect you all to review what is posted here as well, because I am sure I won't spot everything.
I just wanted to express that this patch is not bound to my personal working scenario. Sorry that I may phrased it a bit harsh.
But I will give two examples: I guess form your mail that you don't use the GUI to check the logs, because if you do so how do you tell how old is a given log entry. Or if you add a firewall rule which should only apply on workdays form 8-16 o'clock. So when you do something like this you have to connect via SSH and check the time and for the rest you use the GUI? IHO this is not very handy. Or do you just trust a system that is running 24/7 and you set the clock one's and believe that the time doesn't get messed up (even with an daily NTP update). There are Country's with daylight saving period so timezone offset could also get changed (at least on your workstation).
So this a point for showing the system clock I can agree to. I would like to suggest to add it to the already existing bar at the top, because I think that it will fit wonderfully to the right of the speed -o-meter which can be made a bit more narrow to make the needed space.
The time should definitely include the timezone. I am not sure if secon ds must be included. A piece of JS that automatically updates the time is nice, but must be optional for browsers that do not support JS.
Like i have written in the forum, by end of month I will provide a different version. I agree to perhaps drop the seconds, as it's a good way to save space.
I mainly think that seconds are pointless since time will always be a couple of seconds off. That is because of it being transferred from the firewall system to the browser where there is link latency.
Best, -Michael
Kim
Hi,
On Wed, 02 Sep 2015 04:03:26 +0200, Xaver4all <xaver4all@gmx.de
wrote:
But time and timezone (you do not always administrate a machine that is in the local timezone, or maybe use the UTC time for your network) should really be displayed in GUI. The Uptime should also be displayed, maybe only on the home site. I don't want to check the logs when was last reboot, or if I see uptime is short I can check the logs for the reason.
I don't understand why you need that information. When I want to add a firewall rule or a VPN user, I couldn't care less for any of that information. So, perhaps you want to explain how exactly this is useful for your working scenario.
Lars
-
Larsen -
Michael Tremer -
Xaver4all